I'm just tryna have a chill time man but it sure fucking sucks when people that try and have a chill time too that aren't members/admins get banned and then slowly it gets less and less fun because the very people who would come and join in on the fun just stop coming or can't come period due to certain members not liking them thus getting them banned because they were deemed "toxic" to the community yet when speaking to said community they for the most part were deemed fun and actually helped populate it during off hours.

Omg this so much, i can name names too if ppl dont believe Charles mhm

Honestly it's got nothing to do with admins, it's coming to that time of year where people are starting revising for their exams coming up, and in reason people aren't active on jailbreak as their focusing more on their life.

1. Join EgN [ X ]
2. Become a Recruit [ X ]
3. Become an EgN Member [ X ]
4. Become a Admin [ X ]
5. Become an Elite [ X ]
6. Become a Veteran [ X ]
7. Become a part of Events Team [ X ]
8. Become a Manager [ ]
9. Become a Staff [ X ]
10. Become an Advisor [ ]
11. Become the next EgN Leader! [ ]

EgN| Mr Geeza™ : Why do I always get you and sinister mixed up lol sorry xD
EgN-S| Phillip: Cause you a racist

Jafari asks the wall: What is the meaning of life?
The wall responds with: Kill yourself. DUN DUN DUUUUUUUUUUN
EgN-S| Mr.GoldGames: I asked for a demotion, where's my demotion at?
1 month later....
The following people have been recognised for their service to the community:

Veteran to Staff
Mr.GoldGames

EgN-S| Mr.GoldGames: I ask for a demotion but I got a promotion instead? Life sucks sometimes.

I remember Silver Tongued Fox. Hell, I think I remember him being on when I was just a mere member so long ago.

A lot of the problems now-a-days aren't just in the admins, but in the community (of both EgN members and regulars) itself. Way long time ago there were no nazi wardens, or smartass-based games, or shit like that. CT's were still out to kill people, granted, but in many ways T's were doing more fun shit. However, when I'm looking at JB now, it's been fucking months since I've actually played a map that isn't razor or carceris. That's fucking ridiculous, tbh. What's worse is, every CT warden I ever see is always doing some really nazi warden shit, and then giving no fun at all. Instead they just do math trivias, or prize trivias, simon says, shit like that. That's not fun, that's boring, and agitating. You wonder why regs don't stick around for long, it's because we always have shitty CT's, on a shitty set of maps. Carceris is better than razor and I'd rather play that any day over razor, since it at least has more that 1-3 map games, but even then carceris is just as overused at this point.

Then, you get into admins who have to deal with the stupidity of those CT's. Admins can't go ahead and change the map because it's overused, and they also can't remove a CT just because he's not fun, so all they can do is deal with the complaints from people who end up getting killed because of that CT being a nazi. Admins get tired of that shit pretty quickly, and it only leads to the admins getting frustrated, and admins getting more harsh with how they deal with rulebreakers, and general complaints. Eventually, the admin just decided to leave because he's had enough, or he's going to be too harsh on somebody and have crossed the line. It's not hard to see why some of the admins are getting sick and tired of the dynamic of EgN and deciding to leave, or just stop playing JB.

You know what's funny? Freeday was honestly one of the better things to have into JB back when it was having similar issues as today (albeit with more people), and it at least spiced things up. And, sure enough, it got removed for whatever stupid reason it was removed for. Then you pair up the fact that wardays are now set to expand at exactly 3 (a more recent rule), and it's starting to look like anything that isn't a standard round has to be done in an exact way, for an exact amount of time, only on specific times. CT's who are good, (and those who aren't) will get tired of giving orders here and there and want something simple like a warday or freeday. Except there is no freedays now (which is stupid imo), so instead all we get are wardays that always take place in the same place.

Honestly, JB has just changed over the years, and it's not exactly hard to see how, but the way to fix it is not exactly all that easy. You could be more loose on the rules, and that'd possibly invite different gameplay. You could add rules that admins can remove CT's and add people to CT's based on how they're doing as a warden (whether they're doing fun rounds or nazi ones). You could allow admins to force map votes. You could also do what a lot of older players have been asking for since as early as 2014, and that is to only allow 2-3 map extends before making it have to go to a new map. Hell, you could even remove razor entirely, which is more radical a solution but at least that'd get the job done. The only real way that's going to get the dynamic to change is to get new CT's (somehow), and start playing different maps. Otherwise, you're just going to have to put up with the same, boring old shit until you decide to leave.

Or, you could be like me and just stick to minigames, where that type of shit rarely happens.

Beep boop.

Most of this is what I discussed at the meeting...lol

Jailbreak, the community, it's all cancer. I hate using that term to describe this clan, but if I don't say it, someone else will. I use the term toxic. There's a lot of people and members and players that are toxic. Yea, this a gaming community, and yea, we are all here to have fun. Yet we still have rules, and we still have expectations, and these are there to ensure everybody has fun. Yea, it can be funny to make a racist joke. Hell, I personally find it absolutely hilarious when somebody comes online and uses aimbot and MFKs. But I don't think any of us can deny that that isn't fun for everybody. Making fun of "little kids" is often pretty funny, but where's the line? It's usually not funny to the kid. When it comes down to it, it's not fun to get MFKed every round because then we can't even play the game like it's meant to be played. Well how's it meant to be played? Well we follow the rules and that's how it's played. The rules are there to protect everybody and give us a basic understanding of how exactly a CT plays his or her role, or the actual freedom we have as a terrorist. These people I call toxic bend the rules...you say we should be looser on the rules and just have fun, but how? How fun is it to have a CT that finds any way to kill a terrorist because they took 1.046 steps out of their cell instead of 1? I don't think that's very fun.

On the flip side, what of being a smartass and finding any tiny legitiment reasons to kill a terrorist? A more recent controversy; killing a T for using night vision during AFK freeze. Well how the hell do you even know it was that terrorist using it? It's one thing if the terrorist is jumping around when he's supposed to be AFK frozen but killing someone that you can only assume is using night vision...you really going to be that asshole? I think this goes along with what many of you are thinking. But I call this being toxic. And being toxic is being an ass and bending these rules; which doesn't make it a lot of fun for everybody. So is going "looser" on the rules really going to fix that? What rules could we possibly remove, what rules do we go "loose" on. You all are saying this should happen but how? What warrants us needing to loosen them? Say we take out half the rules then the reverse just happens; nobody wants to play because the server is literally chaos. So what's the balance?

Xanderian - I understand your points, and you've got some good ones. However I'm going to use you to prove a point. Now there's constantly these people saying "Well back in the day" or "It used to be," and quite frankly that doesn't do anything but stir the pot. Things are going to change, people are going to come and go, and everything is going to be different, that's just how it is. I've been here for several years now and I've seen whats changed, I've seen what works, and I've seen what hasn't. But people also come and go and to be fair, those of us who do stick around we naturally just grow up. It all changes, it's simple as that. And these changes could be for better or for worse, but comparing where we are now and where we once were won't do us any favors. Because no matter what we do, or what we fix, or what we break, nothing will ever be the same. The same people aren't here, its not the same community, there's new rules, there's new sheriffs. And that's just how it is.

Razor is a heavily played map. Last time I checked, I believe razor has been played a total of 22% of the entire time Jailbreak has been up. It's overplayed, I think we can all agree on that. But why is it played? Why do people vote on it? Undeniably its a populater; it brings people to Jailbreak. People come to the server because they see the map is on razor, and leave when its not. Why is that? Well frankly that would be because people like the map. So we have the majority of members who want to get rid of being able to extend the map. But again where's that balance? We cannot satisfy everyone. That 22% is a significant number. If people can't play razor well then all of the sudden they don't like our server. So no matter what we do its a lose-lose situation because not everyone is happy. And whether you like it or not, there are people who like to play razor 24/7. Do we drive away the regular users who play Jailbreak or please the members? There is no easy way out.

We have these rules to make sure everyone has fun, like I said. These rules apply to everybody, and no one is above them. We can crank down and punish every single rule breaker and be "that" admin. Well why is that a thing? Why do I even say "that" admin? Because that admin actually does their job? The party killing rule following suck up admin? Well hate to break it, but the "fun-sucker" is usually the only one doing it right. Now clearly many of you think that's a bad thing. But we have to remember that we are here for not just the community and each other, but for the people who actually play on the server, hence the name "players." These rules are set to be followed and enforced. Everyone is welcome to play on EgN and no one should feel like they cannot play. So is this kind of admin bad? Who knows, right?

It's been said and discussed and it been made clear that we are indeed here to have fun. And we give people admin and we tell them to have fun. But when it comes down to it, when it really comes down to the ground, it's written and stated that there is a system. We have a system of how to administrate, and how to handle situations. And it's written that using admin for fun or personal gain isn't allowed at all! Yet we give leeway, and we let y'all have fun, and while I don't think this is true, yea maybe sometimes the Staff let people off on a "warning" or a few warnings. When it comes down to it, the very basis of it, anyone who gets admin is an admin first and a player second. When you apply, you are giving up some of your fun and freedom so you can make sure other players have fun. And some people just simply aren't getting that. Everyone wants to have fun, but it's your job as an admin to give the players what they want, and that's to have fun too, and they come to play Jailbreak, or play Minigames, or whatever. They don't come to be ignored by an admin because they get freekilled every round. I've talked to a lot of admins and players and handled a lot of disputes. And their argument for not doing their job or doing it improperly is because it's out of good fun. They say everyone is having fun, they say everyone on the server understands their humor and don't actually mean any disrespect. Well I'm telling you that I don't care who you are, or who you think is on, or what you are doing, this is never the case. Because the players who aren't having fun, the players who don't appreciate the disrespect are going to leave. And often they won''t come back. And there's nothing they can do because if they complain about it, nothing will happen because the admins are the ones doing it. Most don't care to come complain on the forums, hell, most players I wouldn't doubt even know we have a website. And these are the things that the admins don't see, and these are the things that are hard to consider. And like I said, it is key as an admin to make sure everyone is having fun, not just your friend group, or the regulars, or as an admin. But everyone.

So shit changes. And at the end of the day, at the end of the month, the year, decade, whatever there's only one thing we still have (Besides Kharn). And thats the system. The system is the only thing that doesn't change, and it's the only thing we can default upon. People's attitudes towards the rules change and new opinions come in. Hell, a new meme on the internet impacts server gameplay. Princess Strawberry might do a cool "survey day" in regards to it. So naturally, stuff changes, and we do new things, and we stop others. But we still have that system, and that doesn't change. There's always admins, and the admins job is always to administrate. This system is all we've got. And its to enforce the rules, to play the games, report those who can't follow the rules, etc.

Now I know many of you don't agree with a lot of what I do, or my methods. I know a lot of you don't simply because you don't understand. But every situation, especially lately, is lose-lose, and there's always something wrong, and somebody is always upset. So how do we please as many people as possible. It's one thing to unban a popular guy. But then there's the system. Well at the end of the day I'm going to follow the system. Because the system protects everybody. Now, I know a lot of the replies are hinting at some of the things I've done, especially banning Papa Johns, so I'll address the elephant in the room. I banned Papa Johns for an accumulation of poor behavior. Now I didn't want to ban him, hell I'd unban him right now. And I know many of you won't understand this, but that's not fair. That's not fair for me to unban him. Why? Because we have a system. And its this system that's the only thing that ties us together that doesn't change. He was banned 11 times before he was permanently banned. He had a fair warning after his 2 month ban, was banned twice more, and he had an explicit final warning to follow the rules. Yet he came on the server and instructed players to type rcon in console, resulting them in banning themselves. Yea it might've been funny. But it's not fun for everybody. Certainly wasn't fun for the guy who got banned. And its all about making sure everybody's having fun, right? And while Papa made the server a lot of fun for a lot of people, others didn't think so. And his way of doing so simply went against the system. Hell, oddly I liked to play JB just to hear Papa sing. But at the end of the day, he's micspamming, and that's against the rules. So do we remove the rule against spamming? That will just turn the server into more shit. So where the line? As of right now, we have a system, and all I did was abide by it, like it or not.

And here's the thing about the system. It's great, and it works. Honest. But the thing is its great when it works out for you. It's great when a member uses his admin to give out free spawned in guns and just ruin the server, you can report them, and we'll take away their admin. But it sure sucks to be on the other end of the stick. It sucks when the system doesn't work for you, and naturally you are going to think the system sucks. I get it. But its the system nonetheless, and it's not only about being objective and fair, but following the system, because like I said, it the only thing we've got. And frankly its the only way we can keep the balance.

So what do we do. How can we fix the clan? Honestly, I don't know. We can't remove the system. Do we fix the rules? How? What rules can we take out, which do we change? If we decide that's the course of action, then we call an admin meeting. And honestly nobody likes an admin meeting, and key admins with great ideas won't show up and they won't vote on new rules or changes. Or we get newer, better rules but come to find out that nobody likes those either. Or people get confused because we had one rule and now its gone. Again. Lose-lose. Woissa you claim we can't talk about what's wrong and what to fix, but I see no other way to look at this. Because any of the problems you could name there's only so much we can do to resolve it. Maybe we take up Kharn's suggestion about "Chaos JB" with quite literally no admins and no rules. I think it'd be fun to play. But underlying it could show us what happens if we aren't careful, if we take away too many rules. If we remove the system. I'd say its worth a go. But right now we're stuck. There's not much we can do, there's not much we can change.

I'll tell you what we can do. What is reasonable. We're a gaming community. Keyword community. And we're here together and we're here to game and have fun. But we're a community. And many say we're a family. But we can be that community. We can follow the system, we can be friends, we can be mature about disputes, and we can just have fun. And I think that's all we really can do. But while we do that, there is a system. And just as we ask admins to give up some freedom and fun to make sure others do, I can assure you I gave up a hell of a lot more to be a Staff. Because I don't know about y'all but I really care about EgN, and so long as I am here I will not see it go down.

It's like the "Warden kills only in games" rule. Half the time it's ignored and no one bats an eye, but you KNOW as an admin someones gonna fuck up and freekill someone by accident. So do you enforce the rule when everyone's having a good time, and get some people upset, or do you let it go until someone freekills, and then get some people upset.

You're getting salty fucks either, so pick your poison.

As the great Jim Carrey once said: Stop breaking the law, assholes!

- Going towards what matt said.

I literally could not agree more, I feel you should lock that post there making people left on what you said without any further input. What you said is what I would have said if I were to come to it. I understand EVERYTHING you said, and you did not miss anything, i feel you got everything that needed to be said, and hopefully everyone listens to what you said, and hopefully will get a long and be professional with the system we have. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but they gotta think is their opinion gonna get someone upset, triggered, unhappy about, in reason why as you said we should be calm, and agree on these sort of stuff, be friends, have fun on the servers, maybe have a few mess abouts in server for everyone to have a laugh, as you said in so many words, when it gets too far, when it really comes down to major disputes, major admin abuse, then that's where it comes to a problem.

At the end of the day, everyone is a player, everyone is entitled to fun, a few disrespectful jokes now and there. This problem with Dhack and others, yeah he MFK'ed, and it's right, he shouldn't have, but it literally wouldn't have went that way if he wasn't felt like he had people ganging up on him, making him feel pushed into a situation because people wouldn't stop targetting him.

We should all get a long, if we don't agree on the same thing, then don't continue to bark at each other trying to prove your point. All have fun, get to know one another and just relax!

1. Join EgN [ X ]
2. Become a Recruit [ X ]
3. Become an EgN Member [ X ]
4. Become a Admin [ X ]
5. Become an Elite [ X ]
6. Become a Veteran [ X ]
7. Become a part of Events Team [ X ]
8. Become a Manager [ ]
9. Become a Staff [ X ]
10. Become an Advisor [ ]
11. Become the next EgN Leader! [ ]

EgN| Mr Geeza™ : Why do I always get you and sinister mixed up lol sorry xD
EgN-S| Phillip: Cause you a racist

Jafari asks the wall: What is the meaning of life?
The wall responds with: Kill yourself. DUN DUN DUUUUUUUUUUN
EgN-S| Mr.GoldGames: I asked for a demotion, where's my demotion at?
1 month later....
The following people have been recognised for their service to the community:

Veteran to Staff
Mr.GoldGames

EgN-S| Mr.GoldGames: I ask for a demotion but I got a promotion instead? Life sucks sometimes.

I think, Xanderian and matt have pretty much covered everything I vouldn't answer for Silver Tongued Fox, and indeed everybody else wondering the same questions he asked.

Please /lock for me.

Thanks.

c o r y . i n . t h e . h o u s e . i s . a n i m e

EgN Goals:
[x] Make a gay checklist

Locked per OP