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PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 11:00 am 
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Siberiac wrote:
PrimeLGTV wrote:
Jimmah wrote:
Just to be clear - the admin on at the time should have made the person with those spays stop. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that they were designed to offend.

I don't see the rule being the problem.


The rule is too general.

The point you're making, is the exact opposite of what we discussed in our meeting. The old rule stated that no intimate parts of the body were allowed to be shown. What this "general" rule does, is allows admin to make even more decisions about what can and can't be on our server.

Example:

With the prior rule still in effect, a picture of a dead child would technically be allowed as it wouldn't show intimate parts of the body

With the new rule, it would be considered disturbing and a punishable offence.



If there is any admin who doesn't find something "disturbing" but we as a community do, talk to them and let them know that it offends you and would like action taken. If that doesn't work, make a complaint against them.

Giving our administration freedom to determine rules the way they'd like prevents players from strongarming us into being "technically correct". With these general rules, they are completely up for interpretation from the people who enforce the rules! We as a community should have a general idea of what is considered disturbing, so if something does bother you, the admin won't address it, and you wish to make a change, the report is the best way. With a report the higher ups can make a decision about if it is considered disturbing or not, and can cast a final decision to be used as a precedent for everyone!


TL;DR

The rule was changed to be more general on purpose, and it overall is a wonderful thing.


Well lets say I want to report an admin for not taking action. What exactly would act as proof? Video evidence? The admin who doesn't want to enforce the rule will more than likely not type in chat. Do demos record voice? Do most people record their gameplay? You tell me.

As far as your argument of players being technically correct, EgN has a no smartass rule. Thus, the old rule was correct and those players who were being smartasses should of been banned. No spraying of real dead people is implied and fits into the gore category.

Also, lets say that there is no admin online. Do we just ask the sprayer to change the spray? If the sprayer doesn't change the spray, do we just submit a report for that too?


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 11:09 am 
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No offence, this admin really needs to pay attention next to the admin meeting, because all of those should have been dealt with. At the same time, send a message in admin chat (@ before team message) if you think a spray is offensive, and they will look at it with your opinion in mind.

However, if you don't message admins telling them the problem, then you're not not helping anything, and I'd go so far as to say that you're really in the wrong if you assume an admin should instantly know what offends you and what doesn't, because we can't read minds. You have to tell us these things, or you're not helping anything.
Beep boop.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 11:14 am 
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Xanderian wrote:
No offence, this admin really needs to pay attention next to the admin meeting, because all of those should have been dealt with. At the same time, send a message in admin chat (@ before team message) if you think a spray is offensive, and they will look at it with your opinion in mind.

However, if you don't message admins telling them the problem, then you're not not helping anything, and I'd go so far as to say that you're really in the wrong if you assume an admin should instantly know what offends you and what doesn't, because we can't read minds. You have to tell us these things, or you're not helping anything.


I told Randy and Semi in voice chat. They both responded to say that, "this is the internet." That's not an excuse to allow disturbing sprays on EgN servers. The rules must be specific.

It's not easy to catch evidence on what some admins say in voice chat...


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 11:22 am 
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PrimeLGTV wrote:
The rules must be specific.


If you say that, tell us how the rule should be...? (in your opinion) Just so we can see.
Image

I'd like the promotion, the paycheck and parking spot. But I don’t really want to be in charge of anything.

#Wolfie4Staff2k17/2k18
<05:09:34> "Wolfie" was removed from server group "Supporter" by "Kharn".
<05:09:39> "Wolfie" was added to server group "Staff" by "Kharn".

k :/


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 11:27 am 
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Wolfie wrote:
PrimeLGTV wrote:
The rules must be specific.


If you say that, tell us how the rule should be...? (in your opinion) Just so we can see.


I already stated what the rule should be in my original post.

PrimeLGTV wrote:
As a message to the higher-ups: Please change the rule back to specific indications of which sprays are considered disturbing. (NO PORN AND NO GORE)


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 11:59 am 
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You realize when this incident was happening on wasnt on, semi told me that you were complaining about something so then i did get on.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 12:04 pm 
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Based on what you're saying, then I think the admins should have changed the spray, and I don't understand why they did not.
Sounds more like the admins are not paying attention more than it sounds like the rule needs to be changed
Beep boop.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 12:07 pm 
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PrimeLGTV wrote:
Wolfie wrote:
PrimeLGTV wrote:
The rules must be specific.


If you say that, tell us how the rule should be...? (in your opinion) Just so we can see.


I already stated what the rule should be in my original post.

PrimeLGTV wrote:
As a message to the higher-ups: Please change the rule back to specific indications of which sprays are considered disturbing. (NO PORN AND NO GORE)


So you're saying it should just be "No porn and No gore" ... that is disturbing... so you're saying; change the rule to a little less restrictive.. because that brings it up, people saying: But it doesn't say in the rules, it only says no porn and no gore. Which means it doesn't cover everything it should. Keeping the rule "open" with no disturbing sprays, gives the option to actually tell a person he can't use that one, because it is disturbing..
What i understand of all this, it looks like you're just trying to be difficult.
Image

I'd like the promotion, the paycheck and parking spot. But I don’t really want to be in charge of anything.

#Wolfie4Staff2k17/2k18
<05:09:34> "Wolfie" was removed from server group "Supporter" by "Kharn".
<05:09:39> "Wolfie" was added to server group "Staff" by "Kharn".

k :/


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 12:14 pm 
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Wolfie wrote:
PrimeLGTV wrote:
Wolfie wrote:
PrimeLGTV wrote:
The rules must be specific.


If you say that, tell us how the rule should be...? (in your opinion) Just so we can see.


I already stated what the rule should be in my original post.

PrimeLGTV wrote:
As a message to the higher-ups: Please change the rule back to specific indications of which sprays are considered disturbing. (NO PORN AND NO GORE)


So you're saying it should just be "No porn and No gore" ... that is disturbing... so you're saying; change the rule to a little less restrictive.. because that brings it up, people saying: But it doesn't say in the rules, it only says no porn and no gore. Which means it doesn't cover everything it should. Keeping the rule "open" with no disturbing sprays, gives the option to actually tell a person he can't use that one, because it is disturbing..
What i understand of all this, it looks like you're just trying to be difficult.


I'm trying to be difficult? I already stated my intentions in my main post. Don't accuse me of trying to be difficult.

The rule should be as specific as possible, however if someone finds some stupid way around the rule, then this rule would apply,
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 27, 2016 12:17 pm 
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I agree that the rule should be specific. When you give people a yard, invariably they take a mile (especially in Jail Break). I can well imagine people complaining about lingerie models being used as somebody's spray because the objectification of women offends them. Or if the spray is political, that could open up complaints from players that don't agree with that ideology and find such thoughts "disturbing".

Outrageous, yes. But what I'm saying is that it's a slippery slope.

Jail Break players nitpick the finest details of all the rules. Loopholes are regularly taken advantage of and even the wording of rules is often bought into question. Keeping the guidelines specific is, in my honest opinion, to the benefit of the server. Things may have changed over the last six months or so since I last played Jail Break regularly but I always felt that most of the players needed set boundaries. Otherwise, they resort to giving ridiculous orders like "first person to my spray gets LR" and then slaughter 20 terrorists.

I'd word it as such: No porn, no gore, no discomforting imagery and no visible (or implied) genitalia of any kind. If it's NSFW (Not Safe For Work), it's not safe for this server.

That should cover most sprays should it not?


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